Kazumi Watanabe

For jazz fans, Kazumi Watanabe hardly needs any introduction. One of the most popular and well-respected musicians, he is also one of the best known. Since the age of 18 when he first started playing professionally, he has evolved a strong, intense style of jazz guitar with impact and creativity. He is a guitarists' guitarist. After taking Tokyo by storm in his 20s, he toured and traveled extensively, recording many of his finest work with American musicians, as well as with many long-term Japanese colleagues.

In the past several years, he has recorded works that extend his vision from acoustic technique and fusion energy into extended compositional forms and intriguing jazz interactions. His latest two CDs "Mo' Bop" and "Mo' Bop II" are brilliant collaborations with two of the best musicians from Africa and Cuba, drummer Horacio Hernandez and bassist Richard Bona. He took time to talk about how he keeps a fresh vision of the music and where he hopes to keep heading.

Where did the title of your last two CDs come from?

Well, I thought "Mo Bop" could be a lot of things. Mo' could be more, modern, move, anything, and it's bop, but also it's not bop. There are a lot of sounds mixed in there. It sounds new. I wanted to write good tunes and put together longer tunes. The songs are developed and have many parts to them. I like doing that more than just jamming.

Where did you meet these two guys?

Well, I met Horacio (El Negro) Hernandez some time ago. When we first met, he told me that he had a cassette of "To Chi Ka," from 1980, when he lived in Cuba. He said he had learned all the songs and could still play them all. I was surprised, and pleased, so he said we should play together. I heard (Richard) Bona when he played on a Pat Metheny CD. I liked his sound very much and got in touch with him.

You three sound very in sync, how did that work out?

It's just chemistry. We got together, the three of us, and just jammed. I just picked out a chord, D7, and started playing. It turned into a Miles Davis kind of thing, and got going, so that was it. We just understood each other. Then, after we played a while, I got some things out that I had written. That was for the first CD of Mo Bop. For the second one, I knew how they played, and had a strong feeling for their way of playing, so I wrote things specifically for them. I could think about their sound and write before we recorded. I really got along with them. They are fantastic.

The sound quality comes out really nicely. You have many different tones to your guitar, but they all seem to fit well.

I love technology, toys, actually, but I don't want to just have all these sounds just for fun. I wanted them to fit somehow into the song. Like on "Death Valley," the sounds change, but they all are connected to developing the song. I wanted to have a landscape and I can with these guys there. But, I always loved "toys." I used to read the magazines and try to see what Larry Coryell or John McLaughlin had in their photos. I would get those phasers and foot pedals and everything. However, the first time I went to play a show in Tokyo, I had an entire box of these toys. I began to get them out and line them up, but the club owner came out and told me he didn't allow that kind of thing in his club. So, I had to put them all away.

He wanted you to play like Jim Hall?

Right, that kind of sound. Though I love those technologies, and I still love it, the guitar is really more important. The guitar I love best is an old Les Paul. I also have an excellent Gibson, a new Les Paul model that is fantastic. It's dark blue and a beautiful instrument. This is really my technology now. I like the other things, like on the "Mo Bop II" I have different sounds I can put in the song with pedals and later on the mix, but it's really the guitar that's important.

So, you don't feel such a need to play with all those different toys as before?

No, this year, I turned 50 and it really made me think, I don't want to just play fast, but I want a nice sound. I don't need to play so fast to get in everything, but rather I want to give space and get a nice tone. It could be one note. Like in traditional Japanese music, one note is really powerful and important, and can be kind of mysterious. With the technology, you always know in a way where the sound came from. With other ways of playing, I now like to get a tone more from the feeling.

So what guitar did you use for these CDs?

Last year before the recording, I had to decide which guitar I would use. At that time, I tried many guitars from my collection. I had an old special model Les Paul from the late 50s. I've had it for maybe eight years. I hate to bring my old guitar when I travel. Fortunately, the Gibson people asked me to use a guitar, a new one but a 1959 reissue. It's indigo blue, like a dream, and sounds great, too. Sounds a little like a vintage, so I decided to use it on "Mo Bop 2," and used it on about half the tunes. If you use a different guitar on every song, it takes time to make it fit.

Those two guys are very high energy.

At first I feel like I was getting into something, but then I just feel warm and comfortable and no stress.

In the future, do you have another plan for another Mo Bop?

We three hope to make Mo Bop 33 or so [laughs].

On the second CD there is more soundscape.

We knew each other well and could get together tighter. A couple songs are straight ahead fusion, but on "Death Valley," in the studio we played the song with a score. The first time it was kind of a regular song, but then it continued to grow. In the studio, we made a construction by adding a piece or changing the pattern. In some parts I asked Bona not to play bass, but to play something like cello.

When players are young, they want to play fast or impressive, but these two CDs feel more mature.

Because now I like to produce a sound from my feeling. This January, we went to California, to Death Valley, and took many incredible pictures. And so we wanted to reproduce our impression. I think about technique, and when I became 50, my body's energy is still there, but the power is going down. However, my imagination is going stronger. Your life goes into the music. We also went to Havana, which is an experience to go there and feel it, the sound and the smell. When I was young, I used to see everything on movies, but now I need more reality, more of the senses.

You’re a guitarists' guitarist, is that a nice thing.

Yes, it's a nice thing. But often, guitarists only listen to guitarists. A lot of young guitarists listen to my CD and I would like them to know the great jazz tunes from what I write. I want them to listen more widely to music, and listen to everything, old jazz, new jazz, classical music, and many different instruments. So, I want my music to be a window to get into those other kinds of music, those other worlds.

Your new music has a lot of harmonies and chords, not exactly like a guitarist thinks.

For some songs, I wanted to mimic the organ sound with a guitar synthesizer. Those sounds make the tune smoother. Just bass and guitar and drums is OK, but the sound of the organ makes the feeling of jazz smoky clubs and so on, and you can get into the mood of the music.

Now, you don't play in so many clubs, do you miss the small places?

I still like to play in the small places. I feel the audience very near, and when I play well, they can laugh and I feel something from them. If I make a mistake, then they look at me like, "Are you ok?" It's like a mirror for me to play in a small place. It's very important. In a huge place, you are just saying something to anybody. I use the sound in a smaller place to make a finer point.

It's amazing all three of you from such different places can play together.

One of the great things born in the 20th century is jazz, a great American ethnic music. There is a system to how to use notes, make arrangements, and build chords and harmony. So when I play jazz or blues, I can play anywhere in any situation.  It's amazing I, from Tokyo, can play with guys from Cameroon and Cuba. We can speak and communicate with this system born in 20th century America. It's amazing.

Jazz has for you always been international. When you were younger, you went to America to play.

The first time I went to Los Angeles in 1978. I had a recording session with Lee Ritenour, at a small jazz club. He asked me to join his band to play two songs. I was so nervous, and just hoped I could make it. The audience was very warm and gentle, so I could. The next year I went to New York to make a recording, but at that time I couldn't speak English at all. I also went to Africa in 1996. I went on a tour to Ghana and Gabon as a cultural exchange. The tour title was "Japanese jazz with taiko." We played with taiko, guitar and bass. It was interesting. I joined with vocal musicians in each area, a trio with African musicians. That was really interesting.

Playing with people outside Japan and outside the U.S. gives you a lot of ideas, then?

A lot of ideas and it forces ideas into my music in a way. In Africa, they had a small, four-stringed instrument, a harp really, and it was amazing. Music there still has a kind of magic. With some music, I think I can explain everything in it, the notes and what's happening, but in Africa, or traditional Japanese music, just one note has all this information.

In your new CD, you have a lot of space inside the music.

Of course, there were there musicians, but I have another member in the group--the recording engineer. He records everything, but also he says things sound good or bad. The image of the two speakers has a limit, but we still have the possibility to create a space with those two speakers.

When you were younger, you did not think so closely about space?

No, when I was younger, I wanted to just play more notes. I always wanted to see how fast I could play. But, now that's very tiring [laughs]. Now, the 25-year-old guitarists can play faster than me. I want to find a deeper sound. Even if I hit one note, I want to put more into one note. When I listen to Paco de Lucia, for example, one of his guitar sounds feels like fire. It comes from "duende" which means something like "demon." It's beautiful, but demonish, and very magical. That doesn't have to be fast. Now I try to play more beautiful and clean.

(A shorter version appeared in The Japan Times November 2004. This version Jazznin December 2004)